Amitabh Bachchan and Yash Chopra : Five stars
Amitabh Bachchan turns 67 today and it can be remembered that like the union of Amitabh Bachchan and Hrishikesh Mukherjee union of AB and Yash Chopra has also been proved as a very fruitful combination for AB, YC and hindi films in general. AB worked with Yash Chopra first time in Deewar in 1975 and last time in Silsila in 1981 (as a hero so not considering their re-union in Veer Zara in 2004).
Between 1975 and 1981 this pair worked in five films namely, Deewar, Kabhi Kabhi, Trishul, Kala Patthar and Silsila.
Like Hrishikesh Mukherjee, Yash Chopra also always gave AB very different and interesting characters in all his films. All of their 5 collaborative films have attained a powerful place in commercial hindi cinema. They are remembered and seen as if they were made and released just recently. They offer something qualitative to the audience in each watching and that is the sign of good films. In every department of filmmaking these 5 films have something very solid to offer.
Amitabh got to play very strong and well written characters in all the abovementioned Yash Chopra films and these films brought him reputation of being a very good actor. He got to display a vast spectrum of emotions in these films.
Deewar, Trishul and Kala Patthar were penned by Salim-Javed while Kabhi Kabhi and Silsila were born out of collaboration of Yash Chopra with Sagar Sarhadi.
None of his character in Yash Chopra films was filled with a single characteristic only and all of his characters in these films were having many shades and all of his characters had even negative characteristics also. Yash Chopra did not present Amitabh simply as a goody-goody hero only. Amitabh’s characters in his five films with Yash Chopra were mean, selfish and often villainous too at times.
Deewar and Trishul gave him a ground to be a sulky character, living to take revenge eithe from his own father or from whole world and to heal his burnt out feelings.
Amitabh got to say those larger than life dialogues in Yash Chopra’s these three films.
Mein aaj bhee phenke hue paise nahin uthata (Deewar)
Mr RK Gupta Meri jeb mein paanch paise nahin hai par mein paanch lakh ka sauda karne nikla hoon (Trishul)
Pain is my destiny (Kala Patthar)
Deewar, Trishul and Kala Patthar helped Amitabh Bachchan to present an angry young person who has a reason to be angry all the time. He is slowly burning inside and this inside anger is reflected in his outside behaviour also. At times he appears as a poisonous person who can destroy everything lively around him. He is a disturbed soul in these films. He is good at heart but his past has made him a person whose upper surface has been completely burnt but inside he is still burning and if there is a wind or someone blows a wind on it, he starts burning with full fire.
Deewar presents AB as an angry person who is sensitive to the core and who has taken insult done to his father and family by the society to his heart and now he is on a voyage of taking revenge.
Trishul presents him as an angry person who has to take revenge from his own father, who had left his mother to live in poverty, sorrow and a life which brought her bad image of being an unmarried mother.
Kala Patthar presents him as a defeated angry man who was victim of circumstances and who is unable to bear the insult given to him by time. He was not a coward but he could not take right decision at right time and earned a bad reputation for himself and his brave father.
He is not able to commit suicide also and his helplessness has made him dangerously angry and a kind of sadist who is living in a shell. He lives in a self chosen isolation. He lives among labors working in a coal mine but he is not into their world. Physically he is present there but he does not belonged to that world.
Deewar, Trishul and Kala Patthar helped in creating a super star image of Amitabh Bachchan in hindi cinema. His characters in these films had enough doses of larger than life characteristics. He had a persona to pull these elements off on the screen.
But Yash Chopra had plans to extract more out of vast acting pool of the actor Amitabh Bachchan. He did this job through Kabhi Kabhi and Silsila.
Kabhi Kabhi gives Amitabh an opportunity to live different phases of a sensitive poet and romantic person who has to bury his romanticism and who, during his middle age, has emotions only towards one person and that is his teenage daughter. He has become a hard and harsh person for others. Kabhi Kabhi presented Amitabh in a complex character.
At times he is just mean and very selfish. He does not mind remembering his first love with a fondness and he sees himself as a victim but inspite of being in love once and being a lover himself he shows his cynical side when he treats very badly his wife (Waheeda Rahman) upon knowing that she has a daughter from her premarital love affair.
A poet who used to search life in everything has accepted cynical and biased approach in life. He takes decision to live away from his lover as their parents are against the marriage but his decision makes him a bitter person in later years. It is clear he has not been able to accept with dignity his own chosen decision. He is weak as a person.
Rather he is the weakest person as far as all other characters are concerned present in the film. All other characters have accepted the life as it is and have moved on but he is the only character who is living in the past and with a sense of regret. Except his daughter he does not share emotions with anyone. He has become a closed person. Normally hindi films present the heros in such a way that they earn good impression in the mind of audiences since the first scene but Kabhi Kabhi does not do it. It presents Amitabh’s character wet completely with the mud of weaknesses.
In Silsila, Yash Chopra allowed Amitabh’s poet character to follow again his lost first love upon a by chance re-union. Here Amitabh’s poet and writer character has not left his writing after marrying some other woman than his lady love. He pursues a career in writing only. But he is not a simpleton writer only in the film who does not know the management and manipulations of worldly affairs. He is well versed in all these things also. Once his former lady love enters again his life he becomes harsh also towards his wife and friends. He is unable to stop his feelings towards former love and he has started manipulating the people and situations to get the desired results.
Leaving alone his harsh behaviour towards his legal wife, many audiences may object on his harsh behaviour toward his old friend Vidyarthi (Deven Verma). But that is the character profile Amitabh has got in Silsila.
Human weaknesses have made Amitabh’s characters special in Kabhi Kabhi and Silsila and complex profile of his characters have helped him in keeping his characters alive in the memory of an audience.
Like super hit films of Amitabh Bachchan made by Manmohan Desai, Prakash Mehra etc, three of Yash Chopra’s early films with Amitabh, Deewar, Trishul and Kala Patthar, also rely on larger than life portrayals by Amitabh Bachchan. In these films not only Amitabh’s characters but his superlative performances have been the striking factors and now it will be foolish for any actor if he ever tries to re-enact those larger than life roles in any of the remakes because Amitabh had already played them with a kind of perfection and there is nothing other actors can do better than Amitabh. This is not an easy job for other actors to complement the larger than charateristics entirely by their hard work or good acting. They have to have something special in their personalities also to do full justice to these roles.
Only Kabhi Kabhi and Silsila are the two films, which also had fantastic performances from Amitabh Bachchan, where other actors may try to portray same characters in slightly a different manner because these two characters have a more grounded touch with real life characters. Here human weaknesses of the characters give space to other actors also to give a try to these characters.
Will Yash ji, as a veteran filmmaker, make one more film centralized on an aged character played by Mr Bachchan?
Amitabh Bachchan playing the central character of a 65+ years old man in a Yash Chopra film should elevate the level of present day’s Hindi films.
Tags: 11th October, Amitabh Bachchan, Birthday, deewar, Deven Verma, hrishikesh mukherjee, Kabhi Kabhi, Kala Patthar, Manmohan Desai, Prakash Mehra, Sagar Sarhadi, Salim Javed, Silsila, Trishul, Waheeda Rahman, Yash Chopra
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Nice analysis.
>>> Will Yash ji, as a veteran filmmaker, make one more film centralized on an aged character played by Mr Bachchan?
will be a treat for every cine-lover, if he chooses to.
Yash Chopra seems to be deeply infuenced with the constant KJ rantling for the last 10 years the YC is the king of romance… he ’s stopped making movies that defined him as one of the bests… he seems to be settling for romantics from himself and his production house seems to be more fixed on production values and regular gimmiks..
any film, where AB plays a 60+ years old man will be different than his past films. Even if it is a romantic film it will show the love story of a senior citizen.
Interesting scenario!
AB+YC should do one more film. Maybe a sequel of SILSILA.
25-28 years later! Many fascinating modern tales can be branched out of the Silsila.
THIS IS WAT HAPPENS WHEN 2 BIG LEGEND MEETS.
BUT STILL I THINK THAT AMITABH MADE DYNAMIC MOVIES WITH MANMOHAN DESAI.
Scenes in ManMohan Desai’s films create directly an entertaining atmosphere and they may not have any underlying meaning. While scenes in the films which AB has done with HM, Ramesh Sippy (Sholay, Shakti) and Yash Chopra may have many things happening at same time.
AB has many a times mentioned that he is not yet satisfied as an actor. Time for Yash Chopra and other greats to take a notice…?
BTW the pic seems to be from his last year released movie Yaar Meri Zindagi.
“Yaar Meri Zindagi”-
has it been mentioned in Guinness book of records?
It should be the film that consumed maximum number of years in its making. What on earth might have provoked AB and Shatrughan Sinha to sign this film?
Yashraj is a phenomenon by all means. We did an interesting article on TheReelMag and got rave views. But he is a bit overrated
overrated ? in what sense? critical acclaim?
Some people are born great and some achieve the distinction but there is a rare class that belongs to both. They are born great and they achieve new heights of greatness to assert the fact. Yash Chopra is a fellow of the league.
Nice article written on AB’s bday!!!
After many years when Yash Chopra and AB came back together in Veer Zaara, AB really awed me in the role of Chaudhary Sumer Singh. Hema Malini and AB showed impeccable chemistry as the old loveable punjabi couple. I think that was the best part of Veer Zaara apart from Boman Irani’s performance.
Chaudhary Sumer Singh made me forget AB. When Rani comes to the village in search of Veer’s parents, a man tells her that Chaudhary Sumer Singh and his wife are dead, that scene left me cold because the character’s ended abruptly and that made me emote and literally brought me to tears. I think if Yash Chopra had to make a film…very different from the love angle, like say on the life of older couples or on the life of a Military Major/Colonel remembering his old days now, we would see the genius craftsman again.
Hey!Sridhar I’m again someone who loved AB’s character in Veer Zara.AB & Hema Malini had great chemistry in the movie ( looks like they just continued from Baghban
).Veer Zara was also quite special in other ways- music os Madan Mohan revived and re-used, SRK and Preity playing older characters for almost half the movie.
Sethu, if you remember the scene where AB is riding the cycle with Priety. This is the scene where he shows her the village, the school, the farms..etc..the impeccable part is he is fresh in the beginning and gradually he gets tired at the end. Its almost a 10-15 scene, I am sure that the scene would have many takes, but the way AB handled it part by part is wonderful. He made it look so authentic. And, in the end when he reaches home, the interaction with Hema Malini and she getting annoyed and then he pacifying her. Ah! kya chemistry baap…looks great on screen….
And Yes!! Madan Mohan’s music….as fresh as the punjabi farms shown in the movie…
Songs like….
‘Yeh hum a gaye kahan…’, ‘Do pal ruka…’, ‘Main yahan hoon yahan…’
are evergreen and I keep listening to them whenever I get chance….
Yes Sridhar I do remember the scene,I think AB really got into the character very well even though it was only a cameo.The music of Veer Zaara was special.Do Pal Ruka, Main Yahan hoon,tere liye etc were all a delight.Even the lodi song in which AB and Hema perform was wonderful.
If Veer Zara had explored emotions of AB and HM’s characters after Veer is disappeared, film’s overall impression would have been different.
I would love to see a Mashaal kinda movie from Yash Chopra, with AB playing Dilip Kumar’s role and maybe a younger actor doing Anil Kapoor’s role. Tehelka could be used as backdrop for it.
I actually prefer YC’s angtsy movies Deewar, Kala Patthar, Mashaal over his romantic stuff. I honestly would want both YC and AB to team up, and come with a real hard hitting movie, there are enough issues around, Raj Thackeray, UP,Bihar politics, Maoism, Terrorism. For me it was YC who was most effective in tapping AB’s anger be it in Deewar, Trishul or Kala Patthar.
Kala Patthar was one hell of a movie. Awesome ride. Great star cast. Wonderful performances. AB was brilliant, brilliant, brilliant!!!
Any new actor wanna act like a heart-broken, short tempered, sharp, aggressive guy but at the same time very humane, they should watch AB in Kala Patthar. What a role, I just watch Kala Patthar for AB, each time it plays on TV. Shashi Kapoor and Shatrugan Sinha also played pivotal roles and did a great job.
A wonderful under-rated movie.
This was demand of the film also and in real life also AB and Shatrughan Sinha were not on speaking terms those days and this real life situation helped in creating a real touch in all their scenes where Shatrughan Sinha tried to tease AB. Shatrughan Sinha not only “also played pivotal roles and did a great job” he infused a flamboyant soul to his character in a very lively manner in all his scenes.
Right casting in multi starrer films is just another very good aspect of Yash Chopra’s over all directorial skills.
yep… be it YC, (to me even SRK) … movies that had that rawness were the ones which defined him as a great.. thats what I tried to mention in my earlier post.. even Lamhe and Chandni which were romantics were not the way his late romance stuff are about… a lot of candyfloss… and it was indeed in YC movies that AB, looks walks and talks the ANGRY YOUNG MAN pissed off with the things around him, more than his other flicks where he was seemed to be carrying a brood with a part personal self.. in YC movies he looked like, he wants to make that difference kinds..
Waqt had very well established in late 60s only that Yash Chopra has settled down with the idea of including glossiness in his films.
His films rely mostly on the emotions and this glossy surrounding has to be accepted as a necessary evil to enjoy the rest of the elements of his films and to get the meaning which he wants to convey through a scene.
Best example can be Chandani.
Rishi Kapoor and Vinod Khanna have returned from Switzerland and from Bombay airport they both are trying to call Sridevi’s number.
Rishi Kapoor has not been in touch with Sridevi for some years but he directly dials her Bombay number though he does not know her whereabouts.
Next he reaches directly to SriDevi’s house. She had recently joined Vinod Khanna’s traveling firm as his personal secy but she lives in a very good house. Perhaps VK has arranged for it after he realizes his feelings towards her.
Point is if an audience is lost in these questions that this richness in the art design is not needed then he will miss the joy of watching a very well crafted, very well acted scene (Rihsi Kapoor rings the bell and Sridevi opens the door and next few minutes are just superb as far as great acting by both the actors are concerned).
Past can not be undone. his old films have to be seen as they are. He is not a new or very yound director who can be corrected now while he is making his 2nd or 3rd film.
It’s upto us, we can deny the magic of this scene by criticizing the unrealistic richness present in the house of Sridevi or we can accept this glossiness and enjoy the emotional trip of two characters. Realistic touches could have been better but inspite of this lacking, acting part is never given a weak treatment in Yash Chopra films. That is the USP of his films. He will not make many films in future and we will remember his films for the qualities they have and not for their weaknesses (chosen by director knowingly).
absolutely RK, however like the ‘law of diminishing marginal utility’ the novelty factor of the richness also needs to be worked upon time and again … to go back on the Waqt and post Waqt movies, YC was established with Waqt, but what his other movies made sure was that it reached new highs, one could never say that Waqt was his only good movie… he continued to make screenplays that were constantly etched in audience minds… thats what makes him the great that he is.. unlike say even aditya chopra who still is relied as a great due to DDLJ…
With regards to richness, I had mentioned in quite a few posts earlier, YRF possibly has been coming out with a very varied set of scripts, something everybody has been demanding for… you look at the movies that YRF has produced and you can see the range from a Bunty aur Bubli, to Jhoom Barabar Jhoom, to Dhoom, to Sathiya, to New York to hum tum… each one of them is a novel new script… however, the difference between YC and YRF has been that locales and set have started to take more prominence in the scenes that are shot, that the other way round… for somebody who made AB sit on the Oberoi Hotel in deewar, subtly indicating his rise from a bootpolish man to the guy who sits atop the biggest building in mumbai.. to Rishi Kapoor/Vinod Khanna/Sridevi living their dreams and joys shown in the most scenic beauty, the settings were used as beautiful props to enhance the movie.. unlike the production house where people are taken for holiday trips to swiss and alps, for no reason as such … thats where the monotony the overall set up of a movie is happening….
Question of denial is already happening, with low key responses to JBJ and kinds which were not bad movies in terms of screenplays… good acting and stories are being neglected in lieu that movies ‘look’ monotonous…
well this actually reminds me to give 2 points to a friend on PFC who had always said “stories” are not the marketing point of a cinema… now i get his point… yes stories are important but how they are marketed is equally important.. unfortunately YRF today looks like an assembly line production house, though their scripts and screenplays are still excellant
There is a clear difference between movies directed by Yash Chopra and even produced by Yash Chopra in his time (Noori, Nakhuda, Sawaal) and movies which YRF is churning out in last 10 years or so.
Times have changed and tastes have changed and if a production house is having a reputed name like Yash Chopra then it has to take care of its brand name. In 70s every Yash Chopra film was establishing a different mile stone and they were helping commercial face of hindi films to enjoy the quality and betterment etc. None of the film had similar things. A new film was a new film.
But in present times YRF is certainly suffering from weaknesses and if we have loved and liked Yash Chopra and his films, then we can not remain blind towards this repetition.
Post DDLJ, all the YRF films are marketed very well so that is never a question that a YRF film could not attract audiences because it was marketed poorly. Content is the concern now.
Their films are not able to represent today’s man’s emotions, stories etc.
There is a weakness and they have to look in to it. If people support even their weak films of present times then there is clear danger that they will face more decline in coming time.
the point that you have here “but in present times YRF is certainly suffering from weaknesses” is the most valuable one.. this weakness remains their insecurity … break the last 10 yrs into 5 – 5 years again, and then the marketing effort comes into picture.. their stories are still great… no means was JBJ, Sathiya, Hum Tum, New York and kinds were not engrossing stories… and each of them does address a human’s emotion…. be it foolhardiness to cover our weakness, love lost on marital relationship, or evolution of love, or insecurity and what happens when your very own life is suddenly disowned you … post DDLJ,YRF marketing set new standards, but for first 5 years, then the curiosity to watch a movie was killed by continuous assembly line marketing… the eagerness to watch has been killed with the marketing efforts… if JBJ was not marketed as AB in a punk avatar, but more of like a tale of 2 polar people and the tone had even been of something like Ishiqiya, it would have made some more difference… currently the mantra of their marketing looks like, we have stars, we have the production values, and if you want we can also add the today’s flavors like Konkona, and Kunal Kapoor, Vinay Pathak and Ranvir, come watch Aaja Nachle… the movie was indeed good… the marketing effort just made sure that I might be going to see another Star wala movie from YRF… their content is not bad, rather they still have varied list of stories coming out…calling that not upto the mark is a pretty severe question …
Marketing can affect the film in the first week or first few weeks but it has no effect on the long term reputation of a film. Silsila was not a hit film considering the BO performances of AB’s other films in those times but in long term its quality is considered and not other factors.
Vijay, Fasle, Parampara then also were taken a sout and out Masala films and hardly anyone will treat them as good films of Yash Chopra.
Maybe it is eary but only time will suggest how in 2015 or 2020 people will treat YRF films made in last 10 years.
Young guys, who liked immensely DDLJ, have become more matured as an audience and this factor will go against any YRF films if they dont present something fresh.
If writers, art directors, and other members of filmmaking areas, all have similar kind of childhood and background then no production can produce good films on a continous basis.
Then all guys think alike as exposure is coming from a limited background. Their filmi fantasies will look rather more filmi on screen.
Such arrangement can not work in a country like India which exists at many levels of heterogenous culture at same time. After a certain stage such arrangments are failed in every area of life whereever public dealing is concerned.
Few production houses of Hindi film industry suffer from this monotonous thinking environment.
Software boom, sudden flow of good amount of money in various sectors had created a phase where it appealed to many people when dress designers started presenting characters in designer clothes but same generation has become more cinema literate and they may appreciate if dress designers apply little more mind and give the characters suitable clothes as right costume is a very important aspect of filmmaking. Such things can not be ignored for long.
As I see it, post DDLJ the YRF has been producing movies catering for the NRI punjabis or yuppie crowd say for the first 10 years or so. It is in these later years with changing trends they also seem to be changing but yet haven’t given up their megalomaniac and flamboyance. DDLJ was a milking cow for them which has now dried up. Frequent references to DDLJ in some of their recent movies an attempt to bring that cow back into the business?
The emotions portrayed in their movies looks artificial because it just doesn’t seem to be in resonance with everything around. The content is no doubt good but they just remain to a very superficial level and they can be together grouped in could-have-been-better category.
@Jahanpanah,
That is the point. If under 25 audiences can complain about their films then something is really wrong in few or many of their films made in last 10 years.
Due to internet revolution one is getting cinematic education every single day.
Mere personal touch of a filmmaker is not sufficient these days as cinema literacy has been increased and people can identify what suits a subject and what does not suit.
Roles of audiences have changed.
Cinematic literacy has improved and it may be playing its part in deciding the choices but it is difficult to asses how much it is contributing. Watching the old movies of Yashraj still gives more satisfaction than watching the new ones. This indicates the either the degraded quality of YRF or the later movies fail to connect with the audience as compared to the earlier ones. I think the answer lies somewhere in between.
In old times common audiences did not have any common medium to say their opinions about a film. Back then only BO performance was the verdict for any filmmaker. If a filmmaker used to suffer from a particular kind of weakness in his craft then it was difficult for him to know it as audiences used to accept or deny a film. If internet was present back then it would have been difficult for many directors to include unnecessary and irrelevant elements in their films in the past also.
And behaviour of an audience was different. If an audience has reached at cinema hall and has purchased the ticket then he has accepted the film and would set his eyes on the merits of the film. Now high price of the ticket ensures that an audience will keep a sharp eye on the demerits of the film because he has to get back value for his money. He is not wrong either.
Yup. price factor also becomes important in todays times. A certain Dil Bole Hadippa still looks good watching in a seedy theatre but a better Wake Up Sid doesn’t seem to provide the same satisfaction in a -plex.
Multiplex Culture Jai Ho.
This is a subject which should be explored separately
I think the second part of your article is still pending. In the end it was written continued.
so many times we remain hopeful that we will continue with this thing but later other things appear and bit more later desire to make follow ups of previously written things is forgotten.
Many posts might have ended with this word contd. or something similar.
well marketing of a movie is very important these days specially when you have 2-3 releases almost every friday, back to back … most collections are going to be in the first 2 weeks.. for that matter now even for a film to be recognised as a classic, there is a need for the collections to drop, but at least get people onto the halls…
not only has the DDLJ audience matured, but also the audience which were way too young when DDLJ was a rage, feel the unneccessary forcing of DDLJ…. just the I felt when suddenly ‘ae meri zohar jhabi” was anywhere… movies, ads.. when a middle aged man had to sing to his woman ….
talking about the very diverse indian audience, it has always been this way … there is always a huge spread of audience from different backgrounds… as much difference as there is today with regards to income of the consciousness, at the same time a lot of regional audience has turned towards movies, the market shows higher chances of returns… and refering to jahanpanah’s post, of why the earlier YC movies still look good (which is so true) lies in what Anurag had said in one of his posts which is true for every industry, once you have an ‘industry’ and not ‘film making’ as practice it is going to hamper the quality … the earlier cinema had experimentation… same YC experimented… newer stories or newer treatments… people who dared to give a different treatment to a movie succeeded even if that meant BRC giving an insaaf ka taraazu on a 70mm screen, which can still give you chills while watching it in TV…. the focus has moved from the story and to an assembly line treatment… and YRF is the pioneer in it, followed by Dharma (the same guys who gave agneepath and trishul or Deewar [the other one was Gulshan Rai I guess]) … the day we have experiments with movies … like Aamir Khan Productions is doing, we can expect successs…
just to add, these days it looks like number of industries within industry … be it choregraphy, or costumes, or photography, and each of these mini industries can be defined as say a YRF ones, or a Dhrama ones or a White Feather ones…
Lamhe, Kabhie Kabhie were glossy, quite rich backdrops, but the drama was strong enough in both movies, and i really did not notice it too much. I feel the moment you begin to wonder about the backdrop, the rich settings, the mansions, and less about the drama, the movie maker has failed to connect with the audience. For me that was the difference between K3G and DCH. In K3G, the glossy factor dominated the movie, honestly after a certain point i stopped caring about the characters, same thing happened in Mohabattein, where at a point, i honestly did not care who loves whom, the backdrop again dominating. DCH had a glossy backdrop, but during the entire course of the movie, it did not overwhelm me, thats because FA concentrated on the relationships between Sid, Sameer and Akash, and while it was set against a S.Mumbai backdrop, it could have well been the story of my carefree days too, me and my middle class pals, hanging around, loafing around, our fights, our quarrels.
bang on target!!! DCH despite being set in australia… never had the autralia on your face…. it was about Priety and Aamir leading a life of just happy dreams … similar to what YC had with Swiss in his earlier movies…
AB falling out with YC over Silsila, in a way was detrimental to AB the actor, both Manmohan Desai and Prakash Mehra were more interested in AB the Star.
By now its common knowledge that after the debacle of AB’s comeback in the late 1990’s ( after a break of 5 yrs ) it was Mohabbatein & KBC which gave a fresh lease of life to AB.So after successive failures like Sooryavansham,Hindustan Ki Kasam,Kohraam etc AB did turn to Yash Chopra for help in re-inventing himself and thats how Mohabbatein developed.
The AB-YC combo rocked in all their ventures and even I hope they re-unite to give a long lasting product.A movie with a 60 + character would be simply awesome.
YC can indeed make a great movie on a 60+ man…. though this one remains a non seen by many movie, but Mahesh Manjrekar according to me pulled out possibly one of AB’s career best performances in Viruddh.. never before or after this have I felt so much to reach out for a character that AB has played in this.. the rest which have the touching effect still somewhere leaves you to see whats going to happen next in the movie, Viruddh was like you want to reach out to him … I am not sure if YC can pull one with AB over MM’s Viruddh… this was one of those movies which were not meant to be made genious, but ends up being impeccably good…
Amitabh maintains a standard in all his performances. Viruddh was remake of Mahesh Bhatt’s Saaransh with some changes and inclusion of AB’s Vijay’s old characteristics towards the end. There will always be a big difference between Yash Chopra and Mahesh Manjrekar.
If you think Yash Chopra can not surpass what MM has done with AB in Viruddh then it is an assessment way less than Yash Chopra’s track record of the films he has done with Amitabh Bachchan.
Viruddh cannot be termed as a remake of saransh… the loss of son is the only pain thats common.. the stigma of respect thats tried to be fought by somebody who has laid rest to everything in life and rising out of a comforted chair into this battalion mode is something that was captured amazingly well in this movie… with regards to YC surpassing MM, its not a question on the makers but on the environment they live in … I dont even expect MM to make another Viruddh again … and by saying Sunil Gavaskar may never make as many runs as Rahul Dravid, is never a question on SG’s capabilities, its just a remark on what the situations are…
for all reasons genius is never created, they happen… and with DTPH, YC seems to be on a trail of creating only geniuses, in possible values… and thats where even a Baghban scored much above Mohabbatien, of K3G, while Bhoothnath underperformed…
Viruddh was inspired by Saaransh, may suit more?
There is nothing wrong in it as it has been happening since 50-60 years in hindi cinema. Many a times New films have improved the visualization of the subject handled in old films. Filmmakers/writers take scenes from other films.
Whoever has seen Seema of Kabir Bedi, Simi Grewal and Rakesh Roshan he can find similarities between few scenes dealing with Simi and Rakesh Roshan and scenes dealing with Sharmila Tagore and Sanjay Dutt.
It can be coincidence also and MM might have thought the scene/s on his own. but who has seen both films he can mention that similar situation was found in this and that film also.
and not all the times such refrences are to degrade the new film.
old or new film, they have to satisfy audience completely.
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Dont you think if re-think that Cricket analogy with filmmaking is quite a bad example in this very case. Filmmaking is not dependent on physical strength and fitness as sports are.
I dont know how many new filmmakers even watch and are inspired by the old movies to include the scenes from old hindi movies. They would rather lift the scenes from some Hollywood or foreign movie. Or may be their subconscious plays tricks here.
Recently on PFC when Manish was asked whether he had put the character Swami in movie Sarkar after being inspired from the movie Zulm Ki Hukumat. Both the characters having name Swami are the troublers and both the movies inspired by Godfather are too much a coincidence but Manish told he hadn’t even seen the film ZKH.
Have not followed the discussion about ZKH and Sarkar.
But RGV might have seen ZKH.
Godfather has been inspiring many films over the years. Sometimes film Godfather has given the inspiration and sometimes the plot.
Thing is to make own thing. Inspiration can come from anything.
Have not seen the original film on which Priyadarshan had made hindi film Virasat but on face value it looked that Kamal Hassan might have got first inspiration from God Father and he changed it to suit local scenarios.
Many a times same source inspire many versions.
RGV may deny that he had not kept a look alike of a female choreographer in Rangeela or was it in Naach?
and a look alike of a director and producer in Naach (Manoj Pahva imitated the director).
he may deny and say that he did not set Swami’s get up on the pattern of Chandra Swami.
Or he did not model get up of his Rao Saab matching with Anna Hajare.
or he did not try to model Sarkar’s character on the character of Bal Thackrey.
He may deny that Rangeela had anything to do with Mithun and Jareena Waheb starrer Sitara, directed by Meraj
Its people’s prerogative to accept or deny but Manish did accept that Sarkar is based on Bal Thackrey and Swami is based on Chndra Swami.
Some of them may watch old hindi films also to get inspiration or to take the plots from them. “Paying Guests” was remake of Hrishikesh Mukherjee’s film Biwi aur makan.
then again ya, all the stories are then ultimately inspired from something… most love stories in 70s 80s will have their inspiration from ramayan in ethos, hero getting his heroine from the ‘evil father ravan or the evil fiance ravan’
’s changuls while his friends would amply play the roles of people who pass on messages and kinds…
to me its i think its more or less scenarios that directors can think of.. say even suppose Chopras (baghban guys) were thinking what if the son in Saransh lived, and this son for whom the parents were ready to fight their lives out, what if he lived and had siblings, and then the father realised that none of these ‘worthy’ kids cared about their feelings.. and lo we have baghban … the work of inspiration or remake, as you say might definately be at the back of mind, but somewhere it re starts afresh ….
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With regards to cricket analogy, it was never about their physical strengths that i made the example, but was more towards, the situations then, the kind of games that used to happen, frequencies, the total runs that were considered to be great, and thus the competition levels during SG’s game vs the time when Dravid played his, where we had 3 different levels of games, competitions, cut throat games, frequecies being triple the size and kinds… and considering each one’s environment how one adapted… both are good… and a statement like SG could never make what RD did, is not to reflect upon like RD was a better batsman … its just that in his given conditions, he possibly played a warrior… which SG might have also done…
Regards DDLJ, and some of the YRF movies post DDLJ, the reason why they have a limited shelf life as far as their appeal is concerned, is they work for that period. The costumes and Punjabi village settings of DDLJ were fresh in the 90’s, as also it’s very slick look, but today the same looks dated. Also SRK insisting that he is gonna marry Kajol only after her dad agrees might have been a novelty factor during that time, as traditionally Hindi movies have shown lovers rebelling against their parents. But considering that in present day Hindi movies, people have live in relationships, have sex before marriage, and even cheat after marriage, the same values in DDLJ, look kinda out moded. I mean honestly i don’t think any young guy today would do what SRK did in DDLJ to get his girl( for that matter most of the youngsters in that time too, did not do either, i had friends running away from home, getting married).
Now when you are speaking of something like Trishul, it is a subject that still holds good today. Two guys in cut throat rivalry, illegal sons, we still keep hearing those tales in the corporate world. And while India Shining, MNC, IT has caused a change, there are still many Vijay’s out there polishing shoes, who have come from the hinterland, and willing to take to crime. Even a subject like Kabhie Kabhie or Silsila, holds good to date. Honestly i feel the “Boy-Meets-Girl-In UK/Europe-But Won’t get Married-Till Papa Mummy ka Aashirwaad” genre has reached it’s sell by date.
@ Ratnakar, I guess this is where DDLJ counts in even today … somewhere it this movies weaves that mix of the beauty of life of fun… and still walks back into a secured life of finding life and family, nothing to hesitate nothing to repent later kinds… this is the version in love story , that the truth and the ‘rightful’ way of doing things always triumphs … so even ur friends and mine who eloped would either down right frown and not watch this movie or would like to wonder of this possibilty… like so many other guys and girls, guys to get that wonder that persistence pays, and for girls to move in with their love with all secure life still around…. come to think of it, it was a redefining of doing anything for love kinds which seems more realistic and of liking and appeal than the end of another classic… ek duje ke liye…
I do believe that he is a great man but not as a film maker but as a businessman. I never found him very creative person. Most of the characters in his films are stereotypical. He never tried of making something really different. I found it weird when he was awarded as Zenith of Asia in Asian film festival. Majid Majidi was awarded with the same title on previous year. There is no match of these two when it comes to quality of content. Majid Majidi is a legendary film maker who makes film about human beings. Where as Yash Chopra is a great business man who knows how to sell dreams. Still we love Yash Chopra as he had introduced us to the beauty of Switzerland. It is observed that most of his films are more of documentary films of Tourism department of Switzerland. Believe it or not his films helped rise in percentage of tourists in Switzerland and may be that is a reason why Switzerland government gave him some award. If he is a great film maker then what you called to film makers like, Shyam Benegal, Majid Majidi, Theo Angelopoulos, Emir Kusturika, Tarkosky, Kieslovosky.
If according to you cinema is about creating fake characters which you can’t relate to, loud emotions, loads of coincident then he is a great film maker.
Maggy,
Out of five films mentioned, Only in Silsila, Yash Chopra’s film has a dream song picturised in Amsterdam.
Out of his famous and hit films, I guess Chandni was the first film where some shooting was done in Switzerland.
Please correct this hypothesis if you find it wrong with respect to his old films.
I dont know there can be people who love Yash Chopra and his films because he had introduced us to Switzerland. Many people who had seen Switzerland much before Hindi films started capturing it have been liking his films whenever he has made a good film.
Filmmaking can not be limited to only one type of films.
It is very much possible that if Majid Majidi is given the scripts of Deewar, Trishul, and Silsila then he may not make films which may match the level of their present form (made by Yash Chopra).
Stories of Yash Chopra’s films may have elements of escapism but even then visual presentation of the available script can be a different matter.
Filmmakers can be recognized in their own categories. It is too late to impose definitions of world cinema of present days on Yash Chopra. It may be possible that Majid Majidi himself had seen some film of Yash Chopra in his childhood and had liked it or he sees one now and likes it and leaves you stumped.
You may find Shyam Benegal praising Amar Akbar Anthony while you may make face that how a ManMohan Desai film can be praised.
Hope to see you on posts dedicated to films of Adoor Gopalakrishnan and Satyajit Ray etc.
Will cover AG’s one more film in coming days. Please be there to recognise his films and please support his quality films with good comments.
Talking about Majid Majidi given this kind of stories,as everyone knows that he write his own films. And according to me he is the person who has given justice to cinema. We always say that it is an audio visual medium but in our cinema we headly see good images. You watch his ‘Father’ or Baran, or Willow Tree’ you will come to know how ordinary bollywood(not indian ) cinema is.
India started making films way back in 1913. It was saturday 3 may 1913 when our first ever film Raja Harishchandra relesed. Iran started making films in 1933. but Look at the reputation of iranian cinema in world scenario.
In Asian film festival there was a french guy sitting beside me.We both were talking about Iranian Cinema. An indian and french man talking about Iranina cinema now this is I call a success. Problem with bollywood is that it looks up to Hollywood which itself is busy making superficial cinema.
Because of this Yash raj or Karan johar films, Superficial films like A wednesday. Where they keep calling a man coommon man while he is doing things which either superman or a terrorist can do. Anway you have every right to love YC as he is giving employmnet to many people.
Because of this Yash raj or Karan johar films, Superficial films like A wednesday. Where they keep calling a man coommon man while he is doing things which either superman or a terrorist can do gets critical acclaimed.
A Wednesday somewhere played well with the desires of common people. It was heroic for them to imagine that a common man can control the things to that extent also if worst starts happening in the society.
A common man can do or not in reality is one thing but on screen they liked this idea.
People may have objections on the unrealistic subject but critically film will be judged whether film looked feasible or not while watching same subject visually.
It worked well within the framework of commercial films.
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In general, Our country has been having a tradition of saying things in the disguise of Tales/stories.
And they look unrealistic on surface but they have deep message and that is very realistic and very much associated with human life.
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Parallel cinema in 70s and 80s gave films based on hard hitting subjects and they showed bitter reality and many people complained that it was too depressive in nature.
We have to be clear what we want to support. But most of the time we are degrading our films by taking examples of others films. Which is not going to help anyone.
When art film is released we are engaged in the discussion that it has less or none entertainment value and when a commercial film is released we search art values in it.
Maggy,
Not that there is a need to defend Yash Chopra’s use of foreign locales but when considering facts it looks this aspect has been given an out of proportion (in)fame. Even if we blame somebody our charges should stand on some solid ground.
It seems that in this case people have been repeating same thing again and again so it is looking like a truth today.
If we talk about data which can support this hypothesis then we will not be able to prove this as a trend in Yash Chopra’s films. Yes it has been used in few of his later years films but it is not a constant factor.
In Chandni, characters of Vinod Khanna and Rishi Kapoor actually go to Europe in the story. Only once there is an odd scene where film says it is Shajahanpur, Chandni’s home town in film but in reality scene is shot at Europe. One song is a dream song and such liberties are not taken only by Yash Chopra. And Delhi is also given a nice coverage and later Bombay is shown.
Lamhe – Anil Kapur spends half of his time in London, so London has to be shown. UK has been a major country where a large number of Indians have been living since many decades.
Darr- Dream songs are shot abroad. and in story also Sunny and Juhi go to Europe.
DTPH and Veer Zara – same things should be there also.
We should differentiate between Yash Chopra film and films produced by Yash Raj Films after DDLJ.
Imtiaj Ali did not go abroad in Jab We Met because perhaps his budget and story did not demand.
They should not shoot abroad unnecessarily but in reality If budget allows then I dont think any filmmaker would not like to shoot abroad.
Afterall in recently released Love Aaj Kal, Imtiaj Ali goes abroad.
Don’t you think it is a case of stretching fact too far when you say that A Wednesday gets critical acclaim because of Yash Raj and Karan Johar’s films.
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Majid Majidi’s few films are very good but if you see them one after other then they also have levels and some are better than others.
Over the years I have been meeting and asking many Iranians about his films and surprisingly most of the Iranians who dont live in Iran and live elsewhere in the world have little or no clue about his films.
Obviously they feel good when told that Foreigners like films of an Iranian filmmaker. I have never visited Iran so dont know the fate of his films in Iran but it can happen that other commercial filmmakers are more succesful than him.
We should not compare mangos with apples.
If we compare Iranian Art cinema with Indian art cinema then we can get some analogy and may be then we will not see films of Majid or Kiarostami with same awe feelings as we see now. If we see their films back to back or all the time it is possible that we will start getting weaknesses in their films also.
We should compare commercial Iranian cinema with Indian commercial cinema.
And question of yesterday remains there that do we support good Indian films as we should?
We will watch and praise Majidi and Kiarostami but we will laugh at MF Hussain when he creates a Meenakshi.
First of all let me tell you there are no such things called art cinema and commercial cinema. This differentiation is created by people who can’t make good cinema. There are only two kinds of cinema Good cinema and Bad cinema.
If we start defending our films like this then we will never improve. How many of us have seen films like Matrubhumi, Frozen, and Hajaro khwahishe aisi. There are so many fantastic films produced in India but did not get released or went unnoticed. Because there is certain kind of perception in the mind of big producers like YC that people like to watch larger than life things. And that is the reason why YRF are keep making these kinds of films. Bollywood is big monster and it is killing our good cinema.
It is partly true that common man wants to see those things which he can’t do in real life. But this can’t be the excuse. We have to improve the taste of our audience. We can’t say that people like this that’s why we are providing this.
In year 2000 when everyone was busy making remix music at that time Shankar Mahadevan came up with Breathless and it was a huge hit. Every creative thing has to come from within and it has to satisfy creator himsel first. You can’t say that I don’t like it but people want this kind of things. Bull shit!
We can’t expect a revolution in taste of audience but yes evolution has started, thanks to multiplexes.
There is very interesting example that how much importance our audience gives to the message in the film.
In Rang De Basanti messege was ‘if you have to use Gun for justice then use it.’
In Lage Raho Munnabhai message was ‘you can win a battle without a Gun.’
Both the film were released in same year and appreciated by same audience… These kinds of films never make audience think. If we don’t want our audience to consume the film then we have to find a better way of making it.
I would suggest you to watch ‘Assassination of Richard Nixon’ by Niels Muller, Landscape in the Mist, Suspended step of Stork by Theo Angelopoulos. Then probably you may understand what I am saying.
@Maggy,
It seems you are paying attention to the fact that subjects of the films should be diversified and films should not be made on formula type scripts, there is no opposition to this.
Subjects have to be interesting. But only diversity in the subjects dont make films better. For that people may prefer reading books.
Without making examples of foreign films I am able to understand your point but IMHO this approach does not seem to be without any bias.
And you do not seem to have any desire to consider things from other side also or to see things from all sides.
Inspite of pointing out Switzerland angle you are adament on pre conceived notion. You will not pay any attention to the fact that Dev Anand and Raj Kapoor had gone to Europe many years before Yash Chopra started using European landscapes in his films.
You are making arguments based on convenience because you put up case of Imtiaj Ali and Jab We Met but you try to escape point about same Imtiaj Ali and his Love Aaj Kal because that will not suit your arguments.
How what is good for Imtiaj Ali and other filmmakers is bad for Yash Chopra?
Imtiaj Ali is not even claiming to be following a rebel in present time. He is making his type of films. His films may be following a middle path.
But considering Yash Chopra in late 60s and then in 70s and 80s, it also can be said that he also followed a middle path.
Many of new hindi films directors of today’s time might have learnt few things from his films.
If we seek analogy then perhaps maybe his films were able to give education upto 10th or 12th standard only but we dont start criticizing what we had studied in 10th and 12th stadrad once we start pursuing masters and doctorate degress. 10th and 12th standard had prepared us to pursue higher studies and with little modification they still will be educating students of 10th and 12th standard.
Just for the sake of criticism things should not be criticized in toto. Whatever aspects of Yash Chopra films of past were weak in natutre, criticize them separately for the proper evalution of films as that will bring more advantage to the cinema.
Blind ciricism is not going to help anyone.
Economics is one such thing that any rebel will not deny directing a film for YRF or acting in a YRF’s film.
If idealism has to be followed then it has to be followed in its purest form. There is no such idealism in the life of filmi people.
They have to survive and that may compel them to work in low standard films also because they are getting money to survive for a few more months and they are driven by dreams of doing something bigger in film world.
Every single director is taking care of economics of his film and some may be having higher degree of economical interest but none is away from this aspect.
This is not the case that Yash Chopra has not faced failure at BO in his long film career. Many of his films did not get success at BO.
From his POV, Vijay and Fasle type films were on the pattern of out and out commercial films which are based on formula.
When one director thinks that way then people need to see the difference among his different films.
May be he was not very daring filmmaker in his creative days but at same time he was not even a director following extremely formula type films.
Yash Chopra survived in the film Industry at a time when commercial and parallel cinema both the sides were enjoying their flourishing phases.
When Yash Chopra’s banner became commercially successful post DDLJ, then also other filmmakers like Vishal Bhardwaj etc have been able to make their kind of films. In same Industry Sudhir Mishra has been making his kind of films.
I will support HKA whole heartedly. But it can not be said that it has no shortcoming. As Yash Chopra’s films have their kind of shortcomings HKA also suffer from its own shortcomings.
And there are better films made on similar theme and which make visual commentary on socio-political scenerio of a particular era of a particular nation. and those films are visually stunning also.
So HKA is supported by accepting its limitations because it can not happen with such an effort that it is attacked by hiding behind some foreign films. We have to accept it within the Indian milieus, Cinematic as well as socio-political.
This is objectionable approach that protest and discard whatever Yash Chopra has made till now because there is a need to promote other kind of films.
Leave alone cinema, socio-political history suggests that with such an approach no great change ever has come before the people and only equally less capable rulers/politicians/people have replaced the older representatives of power holding group of people. If Czar was replaced then Communists ruined the life of millions of people and brainwashed them and affected whole world in an era.
New people suffer from their own weaknesses. New has energy but often shows immature handling.
Old and new both types of generation and works can co exist for a better production.
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Again Multiplex angle is related to diversification in the subjects and it has nothing to do with cinematic progress in overall terms. Evolution may be in terms of desire to see different stories but how these stories are shown on screen may not affect the general audience because new directors may take time in developing a new grammar suitable for new subjects.
Even without Multiplexes, Guru Dutt had used a new grammar of filmmaking in 1950s only. It is more dependent on filmmaker and less on audiences.
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Words don’t help always. Commercial cinema, Art cinema, Parallel cinema, escapist cinema, realistic cinema etc are the words which have been used at times by highly skilled filmmakers of the world. In the lack of proper classification they have to use these same words to put forth their views. They believe or not in such strong division is a different matter. And they have made high quality cinema which you must be praising. This is not the word itself which brings the proper meaning but the context in which it has been used.
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< There are only two kinds of cinema Good cinema and Bad cinema.>
It can be debated easily but some other time.
Fellow PFCians –
Something I wrote which was rejected by PFC. Nevertheless, wish to share it with you and welcome any feedback.
RK – Thanks for the tribute man. AB just rocks.
http://thoughtsamok.wordpress.com/2009/10/14/happy-acting-mr-bachchan/
An Jo,
I noticed one line in your post.
You mention (Mr. Naseeruddin Shah’s statement that the only actor in this world who is better than his movies is Mr. Bachchan.).
Has he really said it or you are quoting it from memory of reading something similar somewhere on net?
More later…
Yes he has actually said it and I am quoting from memory. I do not know the exact source. It has come up various times in discussion on TV and print involving AB.
An Jo,
Thanks. I have seen one video where he talked about AB’s input in 70s.
Actually words “Only Actor” look odd. If he has really used these words then they are such a wrong words to be used especially in the case of hindi films. Because there have been many films since 40s and even 30s where actor has risen above the film and overall film is not good but actor has performed very well. There are many films of Dilip Saab also, which will fall in this category.
Naseer saab’s commercial films will also be covered by this definition.
Hindi cinema has enjoyed presence of wonderful and very competent actors in every era but barring few directors, rest of the Directors could not make films which were good in every aspects. Almost always good actors have risen above their films.
I’ve seen this one, and his reasoning was perfect… his idea was Mr Bachchan was the only actor who could act even the silliest of situations with a 100% conviction, his example being making an Omlette along with Aerobics in coolie .. no other actor could carry out a scene like this, dance around the trees and still fight a cause the way Bachchan did… shat pratishat sach:)
RK,
Yash Chopra will not make a film with Amitabh as central character because it has very little chance to be a blockbuster hit. He always makes film only with the biggest star existing during the time of making. Long time back, I had read one of his interviews and he indirectly alluded to this fact.
Jwalant,
But he had made Mashaal in 1984 to fulfil his desire to work with Dilip saab and script demanded a veteran actor. Dilip Saab was no more a BO star by that time.
There are times when financial constraints may guide any director but it is also true that a good subject may generate a desire to make another film with right cast.
And in present time if subject is good then there are chances that film may work at BO also.
RK,
Dilip Kumar was, I thought, still very happening star/actor in 1984. He had Kranti, Shakti, Vidhata, Mazdoor in last 5-6 years before Mashal happened and he anyways was not working in more then a film a year since 70’s.
But your point is taken. I hope he works with AB with AB in central role.
BTW do you remember “hum mehnatkash is duniya se jab apna hissa maangenge” song. What a terrific actor Dilip Saab has been. He would soon be forgotten, if already this has not happened. Hollywood respects its veteran like no one. Look at Jack Nicholson, Clint Eastwood, Meryl Streep etc.
Jwalant,
I don’t think India can ever forget Dilip Saab. Commercial sectors of cinema can forget any actor, director, singer, writer etc but cine lovers, artists can not forget those who were the among first few who brought tremendous quality in the field.
He is very much alive and working on his autobiography (perhaps he is not writing but dictating it) and as soon as it is published there will be a show of nostalgia all over the world among lovers of hindi cinema.
Amitabh Bachchan has been carrying the legacy of Dilip Saab in acting and till he is alive Dilip Saab will be making entries again and again into the memories of cine lovers.
Whoever will ever study the acting department in hindi cinema he has to go back to Dilip Saab and Ashok Kumar.
Ashok Kumar, Raj-Dev-Dilip can not be forgotten.
and in this era where one can go back to any era of cinema through DVDs it is very difficult not to recognize the talent of past.
If I am not wrong DVD companies are earning quite good by the sale of DVDs of B&W films. And Dev Saab’s B&W films are on the top in terms of sale.
Internet has become very useful in keeping the memories alive of actors and artists of bygone era.
Now chances have increased to recall actors of B&W era. Washout condition is becoming impossible.
Entirely new generation may not know about old timers but as soon as they try to go deep into the cine history they also encounter these personalities and then there is no escape.
We never know what can work in favour of something. Hum Log had almost reinvented KL Saigal for majority. Lata’s Shrdhanjali brought Pankaj Mallik etc into the mind of new age listeners of that time.
Nobody can enjoy the kind of stardom s/he used to enjoy in her/his heydays forever but now memories can be kept easily.
This is though true that on an average hindi films do not utilize properly its veteran actors and if it does it then quality of hindi films will be improved dramatically as since begining hindi films have been relying more on performances of the actors.
I think except 50s Dilip Saab always followed a film a year model. in the decade of 50s he did around 20-21 films and after that this rate always remained in the range of almost 8-10 films a decade.
From 1944-45 till 1997-98 he did less than 65 films so that shows his selectivity in the work.
80s and 90s were generally bad decades for hindi cinema in terms of quality so apart from his acting his films also suffered from a quality point of view.
I always feel Chopra’s movies ended unconvincingly.I loved most of his movies with AB but I think the end of movies like Trishul, Kabhi Kabhie, Silsila, Kaala Patthar, LamheiN and Daag were very manipulative and mediocre, Silsila, kabhi kabhie,Kaala Patthar and Lamhein in particular.
Sonali,
Commercial films used to follow traditional approach.
No matter what kind of journey has been shown but most of the time ending used to follow an order matching with the mass opinion in society.
But storywise also according to you what could be the ending in Kabhi Kabhi and Silsila. Considering the most feasible and practical way also in those circumstances?
Not sure how the ending of Kala Patthar was manipulative or mediocre?
Regarding Silsila, i don’t think the audiences would have been prepared for a bolder ending.
But generally i found the endings to most YC movies disappointing, even in Trishul, to date one of my favorite YC movies.
Same with Kabhie Kabhie, the ending resolution looks too forced, does not just gel in with the rest of the movie.
But what could have been the ending in Kabhi Kabhi?
AB leaving Waheeda Rahman and Rakhi leaving Shashi Kapoor?
or in Silsila, AB and Rekha leaving their respective spouses and marrying each other?
If we come across such situations in real life, we say that people should behave wisely.
Once we had a discussion on PFC about KANK and it was discussed that how it could have been if Preity could have agreed upon living with SRK after he accepts everything and Abhishek and Rani also patch up. Two families could have been saved.
Now there was no revolutionary message in KANK’s ending.
Yes Shabana’s decision in Arth gave a strong ending.
Mean to say progressive is not always going on separate path but progressive ways may provoke for decisions which are good for all.
e.g ending of Masoom.
RK no i did not mean AB and Rakhee, leaving their respective spouses, what i meant was all that stunts, action baazi in the ending, really did not make much of sense to me.
yes but that is not ending.
I agree with Ratnakar, thats what I meant to say. Silsila and Kabhi Kanhie are two of the most awkward endings I have ever come across. In fact the fire scene in which AB saves Neetu and the plane crash scene where he saves Sanjeev Kumar are ridiculous. you actually start laughing seeing whats going on on screen….the high drama, intensity quotient all nose dived in seconds. He could have easily gone for some respectable endings. Chopra looked clueless in how to end Trishul, and Kaala Patthar. These endings simply thwarted or marred the intensity of the movies big time.
We can not know how much of such things were kept on the insistence of distributors becuase they might have felt that little action is must in an AB film.
But in any case, what Respectable can be thought about all these films. These are not ending but the turning point which force the leading characters to change their mind.
So how Amitabh in Kabhi Kabhi and AB and Rekha in Silsila could have been pushed towards a heart change?
Approximately 30 years later we should be able to suggest better ways.
What comes your mind?
After Daag 1973 which was very super hit movie of Super Star Rajesh Khanna.Its a wonderful movie made under the banner of “Yash Raj”films. Yash Chopra made this movie after comimg out of the shadow of his brother BR Chopra who is no more now who also made wonderful movies over the years with Super Star Rajesh Khanna. Super Star Rajesh Khanna supported Yash Chopra at that time.
It is said that name was coined due to combination of Yash Chopra and Rajesh Khanna i.e taking Yash from yash chopra and Raj from Rajesh Khanna.
However due some differences, they parted ways and did not work together again.
This was the movie made during the last part of Super Star Rajesh Khanna’s peak period so in many scenes he looked slightly older than the script demands as he did not look me the student at all during college scenes.
Rajesh Khanna – The greatest Living Legend & the real and only super star of Indian Cinema.
There are romantic leading men and there are romantic leading men, but very few have taken cinematic love to legendary heights. While there might be other icons but Super-Star- Actor Rajesh Khanna after four decades, he is the ultimate true romantic legend.
ManoharV,
But Yash Chopra’s full name is Yash Raj Chopra as his elder brother’s full name was Baldev Raj Chopra. Why Raj would be borrowed from Rajesh Khanna, and whose actual and business name is Jateen Khanna?
That is right about romantic films of Rajesh Khanna in late 60s and early 70s.
Sorry to be a spoilsport here Manohar, but Yash Raj was taken from Yash Chopra’s full name- Yash Raj Chopra, nothing to do with Rajesh Khanna.
@manoharv2001: also, rajesh khanna aka jatin did act in yash chopra’s movie vijay. so, daag was not their last film together.
Well, to begin with Silsila was a very matured love story. AB’s character was mature and yes, very focused too and thats why he explains to his wife why their marriage cannot work. Sanjeev Kumar and Jaya too were very understanding and they understood their better halves and what they are undergoing and also where their marriage is heading towards. Jaya has a reason to stick to her marriage as she starts loving AB and has faith in the institution. She and SK both can wait for their spouses to return back to them. The movie should have been ended when AB performs the pooja at his friends’ place. Repenting and realization is enough for a mature person to correct his wrongs. The way he explained his reasons to his wife for his affair he should have been able to explain it to Rekha why he needs to go back to his wife. Being an artist, extra sensitive person it wouldn’t have taken him much efforts to convince Rekha that what they were doing was wrong, because he very well knows what society he(they all) lives in. Some meaningful, sensitive dialogues, graceful acting by all four, some poignant, touching moments and movie would have left everlasting impression. Just imagine, AB shown writing poems in his lawn with Jaya at the background…SK coming back from hospital and Rekha welcoming him…just as simple,more believable. More so, Jaya would have been saved from mouthing that ridiculous dialogue, ‘mujhe phir kaun sahara dega(some thing on those lines)?’
Of course onus is on AB’s character to explain everything using fitting word, the way he explains everything to Jaya. Rekha already had apprehensions from eloping but gives in as AB convinces her. Similarly AB can convince her after his realization at the pooja and explain her the unforeseen difficulties their relationship is going to bring in. They all are grown up and matured. I am sure SK would always welcome his wife on her return. Had it been a story with some younger ones we wouldn’thave expected this kind of maturity and understanding from them. But since they all are so well educated, intense and sensitive a dialogue between them would have resolved the matter more sensibly, giving that much respectable and acceptable ending.
Sonali,
Sometimes people need a shock to come out of a circle in which they are thinking. Stunt was irrelevant and unnecessary.
There could be many options and you opined few of them which look justified.
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some 2.5 years ago I had written following ~
irrelevant pre Climax stunt: AB’s stunt to bring out wounded SK from a burning Aeroplane was not needed in this type of film and Director could have maintained the flavour of the film. This scene breaks the continuity of the film. What was the problem if Aeroplane was crashed and SK was rescued by rescue team and AB and Rekha reached directly at Hospital where SK was getting medical treatment. AB is not playing larger than life character here and Silsila is basically relationship based drama and this stunt scene does not match with the mood of the film.
http://passionforcinema.com/silsila1981-a-conflict-of-emotions-vs-realities-responsibilities/
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Will write later what I can think now as now mind may work differently.