Joker! & Shortage of actors in India..
Few days back I was sitting with a brilliant filmmaker friend of mine and we were discussing casting for his upcoming film. His script is so bloody mature and International that ace filmmakers like Anurag, Shashank or Aditya are excited to get it produced. But the problem is, he is having tough time for casting for the film. We can’t think of anyone else than Irfan or KK. But what if they say no?? What if they don’t have dates?? What if we couldn’t afford them?? I don’t know whether we have shortage of actors or we are not ready to experiment with other actors. Even if we experiment, producer needs star cast.
Now it’s a serious problem. If you are writing a hardcore cult character for your film, we have to count on few faces only, and at certain level even they are getting over used and flop. Experiment with new actors will drop the budget of the film big time.
Now during our talk, the discussion shifted to “The Dark Knight”…is there anyone who isn’t blown by Joker??…whether it’s his pencil vanishing magic or sticking his head out of the police van or his nurse outfit act…RIP Heath Ledger who played this role at the age of 28….such a goddamn mature n cult performance at 28??….Now what if we make TDK in India…who can play Joker?…Irfan, KK, Amir??…we took the discussion to PFC authors and got many suggestions as…Shahrukh, Shahid, Manoj Bajpai, Shiney Ahuja, Saif, Govinda, Pankaj Kapur, Nana Patekar, Deepak Dobriyal, Vinay Pathak, Ashutosh Rana, Boman Irani, Nasser, Paresh Rawal, Zakir Hussain, Shayaji shinde, ranvir shorey ……Some took Joker to classics as…Sanjeev Kumar, Premnath, Joginder or Jeevan…..some also made Joker speak tamil/telugu/malyalam with….Rajnikanth, Kamal Hassan, Jayaram, Partheban, Jagapathy Babu, Jeeva..
Now what If we adapt these popular hollywood(avoiding world cinema for instance) scripts like following in India….who can be ideal actor according to you for that particular role in bollywood…take it as your simple casting exercise..
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events/ The Number 23
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables
4. Al Pacino for Scarface
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather(Please avoid AB)
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan
22. The action girls for Death Proof
I don’t think we have shortage of stars. But we fall short on unconventional actors. Our stars do try to act but come out as wannabes. We need actor on whom someone can put money with confidence. Actors, who can just perform, not act. So go on, try your imagination. Why so serious???
Tags: Joker! Shortage of actors in India
Anurag Kashyap
Abhay Deol
Dibakar Banerjee
Hansal Mehta
Khalid Mohamed
Kundan Shah
Anish Kuruvilla
Jaideep Verma
Manish Gupta
Navdeep Singh
Bhavani Iyer
D. Santosh
Onir
Ashvin Kumar
Ramu Ramanathan
Sudhir Mishra
Pankaj Advani
Revathy
Saurabh Shukla
Shilpa Shukla
Sujoy Ghosh
Suparn Verma
Santosh Sivan
Shashank Ghosh
Shivajee
Pavan Kaul
Partho Sen-Gupta
Prroshant Naryannan
Sam Langoria
Satish Kasetty
@Ashish,
This scenario will not be justified unless stories are relevant to the Indian scenarios. There are very few stories in the world where actors of any country may act otherwise stories have to be changed as per the local norms.
We can see that an american/australian/british/european actor may play the role in Anna Karenina but an Indian actor can not play the roles of Oblonski, anna, kitty, Levin and Vronsky and its not justified to say that what Greta Garbo or Vivian L could do, an indian actress can not do.
I dont see any western actress doing Rekha’s role in Umrao Jaan. Its simply not possible for them.
Its not easy to replace Dilip Kumar from Mughal-i-Azam, Devdas, Naya Daur, Leader kind of films by some western actors. No for that we will have to change the stories and characteristics of the characters he played.
They will have to be made as per their social norms.
There are seval roles done by Ashok Kumar, Dilip Kumar, Sanjeev Kumar, Kamal Hasan, Naseeruddin Shah, Om Puri, Pankaj Kapoor, Whiich will be very difficult for major actors of western film industries to play.
Same is true with actresses.
Every country has social norms, limitations and censor’s limitations are there and therefore actors have to think and act accordingly.
Films in the list should have universal in appeal and many films in the preset list dont have that factor.
Without that universal factor, surely every actor will look like a performer because role was not meant for him/her.
RK saab some of these films have already been adapted in India and most of them can be easily adapted. I don’t mean acting with respect to Hollywood or western culture or mannerism…What if such films haven’t been made in hollywood and we had the same scripts by Ashutosh Govarikar or SLB or Farhan Akhtar…I hope you got me.
And sir believe me I am reading many of such brilliant scripts in India and all the directors are struggling for actors!
munis writers are there…believe me…I have read at least 4 brilliant scripts in last two months for which there is shortage of actors…kindly refer my comment above.
Hi Ashish, My name is Prroshant Narayannan, I am an actor myself and thankfully my name has not been mentioned in that list of yours. If your brilliant script directors are still looking for actors do let them know that I have not settled abroad. Cheers !!!
Ashish,
I too speak only as an audience and interested movie fan. I dont think the issue is as simple as we dont have enough good actors. Its a catch 22…actors/producers wont take risk until cult or character movies are successful….directors cannot make such films until actors(big) agree….audience cannot like such films until they are made…
Only a few directors have been able to make such movies with big actors and get audience to like it…like Vishal Bhardwaj.
After I saw TDK, I too was having this discussion(with myself) as to who can be casted in similar roles if made in India. I was just thinking and this appeared to me…remember joker coming into the mob meeting for the first time and says:
“..I mean what happened…did your balls drop off..”
And now remember the dialogue from Omkara where Langda and Raju are seating on the bridge and Raju is threating to jump and Langda says:
“..to kud na sale…maine ka teri gotya pakad rakhi hai….”
I mean its tough to do it in bollywood but not impossible…We need more film makers like Vishal and Anurag…who have established their credibility and are ready to take risks.
Coming back to your question. Yes there is a shortage of actors in our industry. Everytime I see a decent hollywood movie I try to think of bollywood actors who will fit-in similar roles..and I always end up with same 3 to 4 actors. The problem is most of our famous(that will get producers) actors are “Heros” and their media and public image as a hero is so big, that it is difficult even for directors to see them as any character other than the hero one…cannot much blame audience if they do that.
PS: TDK…What dark story…what performance by all the actors…and what bloody direction…
Hats off to the crew and Mr. Nolan
I would have loved to see Kishore Kumar in the role of Jack Nicolson in Indian OFOTCN
And well, Heath Ledger before The Joker or may be Brokeback Mountain was only a struggling actor – yet to prove his acting skills to large extent. Isn’t it possible that the directors have tried to tap the potential of lot of these ’starz’ with meaty stories?
Let’s see: Saif did do a good job in Omkara, didn’t he, and all we thought of him was as a chocolate-hero-turned-metro-sexual-30 something (and now again the metro-sexual 40 something)!!
I think Aamir could do more than a passable Joker or a Maximus……ditto with Boman Irani as Don Corleone(although Pankaj Kapoor was jaw-dropping good as Abbaji in Maqbool)
Among the others I think Irfan for Fight Club(or American History X) Kay Kay for One Flew and Taxi Driver …….
Let me put my neck on the line for Sushmita as Erin Brockovich ……and Konkona for Sweeney Todd………..
Also I think Naseer in Sparsh was just as good, if not better than Jamie Foxx in Ray
why..so..serious..ashish? why..so..serious..others?..why..so..serious..myself?
This kind of used to be my favourite childhood game.. used to watch those friday night old hindi films in the good old DD days (didnt have much options for english movies then.. maybe video cassettes at times..) and imagine who in the present times would have suited the roles best.. “oh yes yes.. i know.. shahrukh for rajesh in aradhana.. he has played a fauji..he looks good in that.he can woo a girl very convincingly while singing..and he has sang on a moving jeep also!! :D (raju ban gaya gentleman)..
..oh yes of course! anil kapoor for anthony.. the loafer type..jackie shroff for amar (was there any other option?..especially with anil already in..) and rishi…mm…mm..rishi himself?naah..too fat..ok ok..some guy harish (karisma’s first hero)..resembles closest!!..chocolate hero..or..or maybe jugal hansraj..
God! im having so much fun!! hehehe..
…. then i grew up..and learnt from intelligent cinema lovers that directors are still having fun from such “yes..yes..i know..”s
Take a chill pill guys!!! irrfan can do a metro..and a haasil..and a sunday!.. why bother?? kk is brilliant.. try giving him Godfather..and not sonny corleone just ’cause he played vishnu so well (yes im also not considering AB)
Heath ledger.. the impact.. he has had.. jim carrey..my most favourte (and obvious) first choice wouldnt have had.. because.. i saw him playing it.. i expected him to play it..
Prroshant.. dost.. i dont expect u playing vinay pathak in bheja fry.. could u surprise me?? maybe i believe u can..
Prroshant!!..why..so..serious??? :D
Ha HA ha HAHAAH hAhahAHAHA………………….
Rajeev Khandelwaal!:D he can do atleast one of the roles u mentioned above!:D and how abt givin guys like me a chance..we can atleast try if not get it done!:D
Ironies or Ironies…
Jack nicholson’s role of one who flew over the cuckoo’s nest has been done in Malayalam by Mohan lal, In thamizh by Prabhu, In hindi by Salman Khan – the progressive dilution of the role has to be seen to be believed. – In thamizh we have a saying to denote decline of something good – “Kazhudhai theynju katterumbaana kadhai” – Arthaath, i.e., Donkey slimming to become an act – The powerful, vulnerable and complex role done by Jack was destroyed part by part into a tragi comedy be every Indian actor who layed his hands on it. – The original roles are author backed – When We do it – it becomes befuddled, obfuscated and star image bleached that there is nothing left of the original author’s vision in it. This is not to say that there are no good actors, the problem is what are the film makers feeding them for their daily diet – more “Om Shanti oms”, ‘Dhoom’s will turn actors from acting fulltime to just being Ray Ban models. And we have still not stopped rating actors based on their dance movements more than their representation of characters(even if the character is not a dancer).
1. Write good roles first – more – dont copy them from hollywood films
2. Appreciate good acting – not stylish acting or hamming over the top
3. Cast independently based on screen tests instead of couch decisions and personal preferences.
If we do all this first, the we can lament why there are no good actors – Ground reality – there are good actors – just that they don’t want to be known as one – for the producers might stop paying them for being good.
Its more a question of directors/producers not willing to take a risk on new actors. I think the trend in Hollywood is to project the directors as stars. So then the needs of the script is given priority and not the big name actors. Here its the other way round sometimes. A Vishal(Bard) Bharadwaj first decides on stars like Bipasha Basu and Saif and then goes about writing a script to suit them. This is even more true of directors like David Dhawan and Aneez Bazmee. Rajeev Khandelwal, Manoj Bajpai, KK, and all those new actors being trained at FTII could fit the bill, if only people would give them a chance.
For a spoof how about Shakti Kapoor for “The Joker”…he could even change the line “Why so serious?” to “Subah mirchi ka acchar khaya tha kya?” from Gunda
Ashish
In fact this used to be a favorite pastime of mine, whenever i wud watch a Holly flick, my immediate thought wud be if this were made in Hindi or any other regional language who could do it.
Al Pacino’s Scarface has already been done in Bollywood by both Amitabh Bachan in Agneepath and Sanjay Dutt in Vaastav.
Sunju’s performance i think was brilliant, he has that intensity and vulnerability. In Vaastav, that drug addict angle was clearly inspired by Pacino’s in Scarface, as was Pacino’s hot headed nature.
AB’s in Agneepath, had a lot of Pacino influence to it. The scene in the restaurant, is clearly inspired by Pacino’s “Make Way for the Bad Man” scene in Scarface. Also AB’s relation with his mom and sis, is again taken from Scarface. Only thing is he does not shoot his sisters boyfriend as Pacino does in Scarface.
Comming to Jack Nicholson’s role in One Flew Over Cuckoo’s Nest, it was already done by Mohanlal and i really dont have much to add to what Jai Ganesh says. Jack’s role in The Shining, for me the best choice appears Manoj Bajpayee, he has that manic intensity.
Now comming to De Niro. Mean Streets role, choose between Manoj Bajpayee or Sunjay Dutt, both have that hot headed streak in them. And The Untouchables role of Al Capone, ah this has been another favorite pastime of mine.For me the best choices for that role would be Nana Patekar/ Irfan Khan.
And as far as Tom Hanks is concerned, for me the best choice would be Aamir Khan. I mean when i picture Aamir as Forrest Gump, he just suits that role to a T. Aamir would do well in Philadelphia, though given Sanjay Suri’s brilliant act in My Brother Nikhil, i would go for him. Honestly speaking i think The Terminal is not such a great movie.
Joe Pesci as the hot head in Goodfellas/Casino, i think my choice would go for Zakir Hussain, who was brilliant in Johnny Gaddar.
Samuel Jackson in Pulp Fiction again take a pick from Kay Kay/Zakir Hussain/Manoj Bajpayee or if u want some one more underrated Deepak Dobriyal from Omkara.
Well we already had apna Akshay playing Hannibal Lecter in a desi version of Silecne of Lambs called Sangarsh. But my choice for this would be Pankaj Kapoor. He is just brilliant when it comes to displaying menace with subtle underplay and gestures, never going over the top.
Or yes Kamal Hassan, who would be my choice for this.
Naseer’s role in 3 Deewarein was based on Morgan Freeman’s Red in Shawshank Redemption. And while Jamie Foxx was great in Rayy, watch Sparsh, to see Naseer in one of the best role of a blind person. It is just brilliant.
Ed Norton roles in American History X, could be done by Ajay Devgan. He had already done a great act in the desi version of Primal Fear.
And Ed’s role in Fight Club, take a pick between Akshaye Khanna/Saif.
Russel Crowe in Gladiator? Well honestly i felt Gladiator was a pretty much overrated flick, the second half was more like a WWF special. And it was not one of Crowe’s best performances. But still if u insist, Sunny Deol is one actor, who would really suit the role. Yeah i know people associate Sunny with the Gaddar kind of movies, but watch his performances in earlier movies like Arjun, Dacait, Ghayal, Damini he conveys a lot without resorting to screaming or shouting.
let’s not forget that Kamalhassan did swathi muthyam BEFORE Forrest Gump.
…play the game guys, stop arguing…
@Aditya, Ratnakar and others – Not bad…go on!
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events/ The Number 23 – None
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining –
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables – Aamir Khan
4. Al Pacino for Scarface – Aamir Khan
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather(Please avoid AB)
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino –
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction – Nana Patekar
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs –
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X – Imran Khan
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator – Aamir Khan
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption – sorry, Nana again!
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray – wtf!
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd – Akshay Kumar
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream – wahida rehman?
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd –
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich – Madhuri
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill – Priety Zinta
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan
22. The action girls for Death Proof
btw my dream project is to remake Departed with
Amitabh Bachchan – Costello
Aamir Khan – Billy Costigan
Shahrukh Khan – Sullivan
Salman Khan – Dignam
Dharmendra – Wot was Martin Sheen’s character?
BUT STRICT NO-NO RAM GOPAL VARMA – Martin Scorcese
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events/ The Number 23
- Govinda…he can..he can!!!
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining
- Paresh Rawal/ Naseer Shah…they definitely can!!
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables
- Aamir Khan or Hrithik..am serious!
4. Al Pacino for Scarface
- Hrithik again or Ranvir Sheroy
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather(Please avoid AB)
- Pankaj Kapoor (pls forgive me here) or Mohanlal or Om Puri
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal
- Aamir Khan for the first two, Govinda for the third!
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino
- Vinay Pathak/ Zakir Hussain/ Amit something from Ek Chalis..he was just wonderful, that actor!!
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction
- Kay Kay..Irrfan..Akshay Kumar!!
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs
- Only Pankaj Kapoor!
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X
- Kay Kay or Naseer
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator
- Saif Ali Khan..all the way
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption
- Paresh Rawal or Boman again…
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray
- Irrfan/Abhay Deol/Ranvir
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd
- very difficult..but Kamal hassan only comes to mind!!
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream
- no one!!!!!!!!!!!!!
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby
- Prachi Desai
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd
- oh oh..Konkona or maybe just maybe Asin or Kangana
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich
- Konkona or Chitrangada Singh..intensity needed
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill
- Sushmita..get her slimmed down and she’ll rock this!!
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel
- naaahhhhh
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan
- Bring back Sridevi!!!!!!!!!!!!!
22. The action girls for Death Proof
- Sushmita, Yana and Neha Dhupia probably..tee hee!!
As y’ll could see it got downright tough when I got down to the female actors..I was only flip flopping between Konkona, Chitrangada, Sushmita, Neha Dhupia, etc..had to really scratch brains for the others..but let the jury be out on my choices!!
Like all other things actors are products of their time-space as RK had said earlier. Casting will depend on how you interpret/localise those films (that is you can not think of THE UNTOUCHABLES and cast someone in.You need to have the scenario et script first.Otherwise it is a wild goose chase.).
Then it is the shortage of mechanism/methods/schools and movements that is serving along with erring producers/directors (who ARE HELL BENT TO CAST STARS FOR BUSINESS and yet that always are not serving even commercially) to make it more painful.
Lastly if you have a great script in your hand, then go ahead to find out suitabe features first.A great director can even make out a lampost to act and win oscars.That is also a part of director’s brilliance.Train them, give time to them and make them act before your camera dear.A great film is a killing one in respect to time it needs.
Lastly,ask them not to loose their heart.Many in world cinema had done masters with non-actors even.Go ahead with conviction, this is not theatre and you, as a director have a upper hand.You need not to depend on actors (obviously have to spend a good time to make a single film in that process), they will depend upon you.
Well am also trying the nearest possibilities…I donno how much they’ll match..
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events – Sharman Joshi/ Govinda/ Arshad Warsi
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining – Amir Khan/ Arshad Warsi/ Irfan
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables – Sanjay Datt/ Saif/ Abhishek/ Hritik
4. Al Pacino for Scarface – Sajay Datt/ Pawan Malhotra/ Zakir Husain/ KK/ Irfan/ Ajay Devgan
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather(Please avoid AB) – Nasser/ Danny/ Pankaj Kapoor/ Nana/ Dharamji
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal – Amir/ KK/ Kamal Hassan
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino – Vinay/ Zakir Hussain/ Sayaji Shinde/ Ashutosh Rana/ Manoj Bajpai
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction – Nasser/ Zakir Hussain/ Boman Irani/ Nana Patekar/ Anil Kapoor
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs – Big B/ Nasser/ Om Puri/ Nana/ Boman/ Kamal Hassan
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X – Saif/ Vivek / Amir/ Ajay Devgan/ Abhay Deol
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator – Sanjay Datt/ Ajay Devgan/ Amir Khan/ Kamal Hassan
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption – Nasser/ Om Puri/ Boman Irani
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray – Boman Irani/ Nasser/ Pankaj Kapoor
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd – Irfan Khan/ KK
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream – Dimple Kapadia/ Sarika/ Shabana Azmi/ Seema Biswas
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby – Shilpa Shukla/ Sushmita Sen/ Bipasha Basu/ Chitrangada Singh
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd – Konkona Sen/ Rani/ Sandhya Mrudul / Urmila
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich – Kajol/ Konkona Sen/ Rani Mukharjee/ Sushmita/ Madhuri Dixit
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill – Karena Kapoor/ Priyanka Chopra/ Sushmita/ Sandhya Mrudul/Deepika
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel – Chitrangada Singh/ Kajol/ Madhuri Dixit
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan – Kangna Ranaut/ Antara Mali/ Urmila/ Sandhya Mrudul
22. The action girls for Death Proof – Sandhya Mrudul/ Shilpa Shukla/ Sameera Reddy/ Chitrashi Rawat/ Neha Dhupia
Well the above matching is only if we adapt them in India, changing the character lil bit in Indian scenario…not in originals.
Seema Biswas is a good choice for Ellen in Requiem..Ashish, I just could not remember her!!
@Ashish(2),
Yesterday I had to make comment in hurry. Its good that adaptation- the right word, has come in and adaptation is never an area of any actor. Writers/Directors have to conceptualise and create characters which look convincing in a country’s local scenario.
We know it very well that since 1940s and 50s, hindi films have been making on the adapted plots and we know several of them have been equally and sometimes more competent than the original english films.
Sohrab Modi successfully adapted some classic stories.
Was not Chori-Chori, hindi adaptation of Samual Adam’s written Hollywood film It happened one night. Raj Kapoor did not play the role of the reporter with conviction?
Roman Holiday is not very much different than IHON. and again in Dil Hai ki Manta nahin, Aamir Khan played the role of repoter well or not?
What about Satte Pe Satta. did that film give clue that there is some lacking and original should be seen for bigger satisfaction? and SPS deviate quite far from the original Seven Brides for Seven Brothers.
Agneepath is rehashed and bit more and different version of Scarface.
I would dare to say that Directors have been lacking especially in Hindi cinema and Actors have always been existing. Leaving few able directors, hindi cinema suffers from dearth of good and visionary directors.
Better questions are who could make such films in Hindi cinema because if directors are good chances are very high that they will take appropriate acting from their actors.
Its quite insulting towards great actors of Indian cinema to see them as desi versions of hollywood actors. They work as per the available scripts.
Its good to know that at present brilliant scripts are existing in hindi cinema. Hopefully these brilliant scripts get brilliant directors also. Its not necessary that those who have written these brilliant scripts will make brilliant films also. Chances are 50%. Sometimes it happens and sometimes it does not happen. Everybody is not a director. some remain better writer and some become better director.
Its a question of making Godfather in India because many have been there to give a tough competition to Marlon Brando and Al Pacino.
In Overall comparsion, Marlon will have to take a back seat. He can never compete the comedy skills of Ashok Kumar, Dilip Kumar, Dharmendra, Amitabh Bachchan, Kamal Hasan, Naseer, Om Puri and Pankaj Kapoor. They are far better actors in comedy than him and Al Pacino. But we dont not ask this question who from hollywood can play what these Indian actors have played?
I dont think Samual Jackson’s role in Pulp Fiction can be seen as great example of acting. He had to deliver dialogues with flat face. His character was devoid of human emotions. He and John Travolta were given styles by director and not scenes to do great acting. Both were aptly used by QT as a good director. Beauty of the film is in presentattion and not in the acting by an individual.
If you have seen Mani Kaul’s Idiot and have seen Aamir Khan closely you may keep hope that if 12 Monkeys is made in hindi then both may play Brad Pitt’s role with competency. But question remains that who is the director who can envisage such a film and character and his traits?
I mean to say that for imagination point of view its good to see the possibility, which Indian actor can play some famous roles in some famous films but if we ask this by doubting acting capabilities of good actors of India then its not justified and certainly not based on facts. Major question always remains that where are the directors who can make good films wth universal appeal?
It will be interesting to know from Shekhar Kapur what he thinks about his actresses?
Does he find Cate B was better in Elisabeth 1&2, than Seema Biswas in Bandit Queen and Shabana Azmi in Masoom and Sri Devi in Mr India and his answer should solve this question. Because he is the only director available who has handled different stories. We have adaptation of Macbeth and Othello in Maqbool and Omkara and we know hindi actors were quite competent but still Vishal Bhardwaj has no exposure of directing international actors/stars.
Such things can be measured by plots like Ocean series where actors of different countries can be gathered and director should be impartial and should concentrate on making a good film.
Gandhi and Shatranj ke Khiladi are two good example. Gandhi is made by a british, but majority of characters are Indian and can we say that these indian actors were weaker in their acting/perforamnces?
SKK- Richard Attenborough acted in that film and can we say that S Ray did not take good acting from him? He acted very well in small role.
Not all films do this justice. Naseer was given the role but not the space in TL of E Gentlemen. Unless actors dont get fair chances and good roles in international roles, this whole discussion is hypothetical.
Shantaram the book gives that chance and if film is made with appropriate opportunities to all the characters and only Johnny Depp does not take the cake then we will see what happens.
If we have more stars and actors are happy in remaining as stars then directors are not less responsible for this state.
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events/ The Number 23—Sharman Joshi,Govinda
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining–Irfan Khan
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables—Aamir Khan
4. Al Pacino for Scarface—Aamir Khan
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather(Please avoid AB)–Pankaj Kapoor/Naseer
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal—Aamir
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino—Naseer
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction—Paresh Rawal
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs—Boman Irani
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X–Aamir
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator–Akshay Kumar
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption—Naseer
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray–
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd—Salman(LOL)
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream–Seema Biswas(good choice)
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby–Chtrashi Rawat
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd—Kangana Ranaut
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich–Sushmita Sen
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill—Sushmita Sen
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel—Kareena Kapoor
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan—Chitrashi Rawat
22. The action girls for Death Proof—-the same above
@Ashish,
Perhaps you also were associated with the making of NO SMOKING.
Director actor relation can be understood by that film.
Scene 1- Ayesha Takia is watching the film (perhaps SL) on TV and sheding tears. John comes out of bathroom and asks what has happened and she replies that they are taking them to concentration camp.
John sees card of Baba Bengali and there is little conversation and then John says in dictating tone,” Nashta kar lein”.
Watch Ayesha’s reactions, expressions and they define the character of John completely and even better than the performance of John himself. Ayesha’s act is world class. You dont need to compare her with anyone in the world. Thats a class act where an actor delivers something on deeper level.
Come to second scene on breakfast scene. John asks,” Is baar anniversary par kya chahiye”.
Aesha aptly says,” Divorce”
John says,” Itna budget nahin hai mere pass”.
Camera shows Ayehsa Takiya in close up but this time she throws back blank expressions. Because possibilities are that Anurag either did not want more than this or he did not make her understand that here also she can go deeper. Actress is same but in one scene director shows her as a highly competent world class actresses and in other scene she is given OK with her average performance only ( Unless director needed exactly that blank look- because this is compensated by a fast background music).
and same Ayesha Takia’s talent is wasted in films like De Taali.
She has potential but where are directors and if there are directors, are they interested in helping in her flourishing?
Do we have scripts which may ask actors to perform on deeper level?.
and if you remember we had talked about one scene in Manorama SFU, in January.
There also we find example of Director-actor relation.
Abhay Deol gave many good scenes in the film which matched with his character in the film but he spoiled a very important scene and this was the scene which could have brought him appreciation as an actor but he missed the chance and it can not be his mistake only. Director is also responsible for the lack of good performance in that scene.
Scene where he is coming back to home in drunken state and Sarika stops him.
He could not make this scene good. Either he did not do good rehearsal and relied on giving the scene directly and hence he could not lift that scene. There is no proto type how a druken man will behave but in films a man should look genuine. He was found trying hard to do justice to the scene but could not.
If Director can take 10 good scenes from same actor in same film but remain satisfied with below average performance in a big scene and which is a turning point scene in the film, then he also shares equal and even more responsibility for this lacking. Once an actor is chosen for a script. Its responsibility of the director to extract best out of him/her.
RK bang on target..
very well written…
u know ashish’s assessment of indian actors in the post reminded me of dilip vengsarkar’s statement some months back about team selection ” there is not enough talent to pick from except the 30-odd who feature regularly in the team.”
lets reverse this ..can we…?
who from hollywood would convincingly play gabbar….?
…you dint get the post ashwin…read again carefully….
…and as far as sholay is concerned, watch the western films its been inspired from…you may get your gabbar too!
@Ashwin,
I said things in general. Ashish’s post gave me that opportunity to discuss those things.
ashish…
every hollywood character u mentioned above may have had their share of influences just like gabbar has…..
what matters is whether it rises above its influence to become a cult and it does…..
what i meant was whats the harm in trying the reverse ….
why not for once try thinking of any hollywood star who could pull of a sharabi or an anand………
and i dont think that i didnt get the post……..
i disagree that we dont have unconventional actors…
what we do lack is enterprising and unconventional producers and directors….
an able director can use a conventional actor unconventionally (for instance Aamir as the tapora in Rangeela)
however we are do catching up in the director’s department courtesy ( farhan akhtar, anurag kashyap, sriram raghavan etc etc)
and also i have no problems with the casting exercise ..
sometimes its good fun..
..see ashwin I understand your viewpoint…but you still havn’t got my post…I never said “we dont have unconventional actors”…I said “we fall short on unconventional actors”…that’s why I said read carefully…
…and believe me there are producers too…after warner bros., fox searchlight, sony, Zee, Mahindra, Reliance, Studio18 came…there are so many producers that we are falling short on good directors now…so what you are talking is very diff. from ground reality…very encouraging though!
If your writer friend with ‘bloody mature and international’ script is so ‘brilliant’, then how come he cannot use his intelligence to find the answer himself? or look for a new actor. Whatever happened to screen testing?
This post is perhaps asking a wrong question itself.
ashish….
well then its heartening to hear that there are good producers out there……
we can probably expect some good movies in the future…
I am interested in the role. Please take a look at my webpage www.ukscreen.com/cast/mohammed for Resume and photos.
The latest Feature film I worked on ‘Dark Cloud’ screened at
Himalaya Palace Cinema in Southall on Sunday 13th July 2008 at Midday.
It is an Anglo/Afghan production.
A link to my latest short film ‘Devils Breath’ is below….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggS-dZONRdY
You can Watch a trailer of Dark Cloud using the link below..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHOnbwmetjQ
I look forward to hearing from you soon.
Best
Mohammed Quraishi
oh jateen! man I was waiting for this…dude the thing is we are living in such a hypothetical world of cinematic theory…sirjee wot an idea of screen testing!!…do you think filmmakers never think of this while casting??
Yes ashwin…there is lot of hope coming…sab change ho raha hai dheere dheere…so actors ka issue bhi solve ho jayega shayad!
@Ashis
In football there were ‘Spotters’ and ‘Coaches’ once.Very often than not one man had played these two different roles.There was a general lack in mechanism like GYM,FITNESS TRAINNING,MONEY,FAME etc etc.Now it is all available.But in Kolkata now there is no Bagha som,Achyutda etc etc who had spotted talents from various corners of Bengal and had curved out a player with strong basics and skills.Now we have money,mechanism,tele coverage and all.
Ashis, a search is necessary and on the contrary we have a system that have quitely killed our mobilty.We,diectors have become MAN-GOD and by seating in our own abode we are expecting that year after year some special talent will come to my screen test and from the first shot that one will be jaw-dropping actor.
The system you are talking about is like any motorcar making industry.Parts will be made and fitted in same manner with same precission and a car will come out.
This is inhuman. This is not cinema, a production only.Let the producers and directors come out from their jet-set life and let them travell through BHARAT not INDIA and I am sure they will find derth of talents.
I am seeing them in theatres (unknown and unfancied),in town,villages and city.They are uncut diamonds.We need to cut and polish them to have a great shape.
And given that,I can challenge any dam actor from any part of the world.
WE HAVE AN EXPERIENCE OF 2500 YEARS AT LEAST.GREECIANS ONLY CAN COME TO A CLOSE COMPETITION.
Rk sir@29:
You nailed it. Jai Ho!
mediocrity and impotent means of expression oozes out of every form of media in our country. look at your write-up, i do not mean to belittle or demean you, but the very fact that a mature thought as the one that you have expressed is stymied by your lack of articulation in the language that you are forced to express yourself in, just makes your piece an object of bare ridicule or a source to dump cheap pity on.
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to correct and be grammatically correct and express what I think you meant to …
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see minor and may appear to be irrelevant changes but to the discerning audience you are love story 2050 vs the dark knight even given anurag, who, frankly speaking, i think is over-hyped and a creation & propagation of this particular site.
…completely agree RK sir!…but I was more talking over the ground reality TODAY which is, If you have a great lil offbeat script…you have to depend on few faces only…and more if its your first film…you may understand in much better way if we sit and start calling actors for the role!
.
…am too missing Sanjeev Kumar, Ashok Kumar and Balraj Saab today becoz they don’t exist anymore…I still feel being a gr8 script, lead casting of No smoking was a compromise…I loved Aysha as Anjali the wife but I dint like her as Annie the secretory…I couldn’t take her…But yes I do believe magic of the director as you said and that shows in Johns performance!
.
@ Ram – you got it dude!!…so stay disappointed…thanx!
1. Jim Carry for The Grinch/ A Series of Unfortunate Events/ The Number 23 (Javed Jaffrey / Akshay Kumar / Ritesh
Deshmukh)
2. Jack Nicolson for One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest/ The Shining (Shiney Ahuja)
3. Robert De Niro for Mean Streets/ Raging Bull/ The Untouchables (Atul Kulkarni)
4. Al Pacino for Scarface (Neil Nitin Mukesh)
5. Marlon Brando for The Godfather (Has anyone ever thought of Sharad Saxena for this one?)
6. Tom Hanks Philadelphia/ Forest Gump/ The Terminal (Sanjay Suri / Rajeev Khandelwal / Maybe an older Shahid
Kapoor)
7. Joe Pesci for Goodfellas/ Casino (Prasand Purandare of Ab Tak 56 & Contract)
8. Samuel Jackson for The Pulp Fiction (Nana Patekar)
9. Anthony Hopkins for The Silence of the Lambs (Shiney /
10. Edward Norton for The Fight Club/ American History X (Sharman Joshi)
11. Russel Crowe for A Beautiful Mind/ Gladiator (Randeep Hooda)
12. Morgan Freeman for The Shawshank Redemption (Danny Denzongpa / Rajat Kapoor)
13. Jamie Foxx for Ray (haven’t seen yet)
14. Johnny Depp for Sweeney Todd (Prashant Narayanan of Chhal)
15. Ellen Burstyn from Requiem for a Dream (haven’t seen yet)
16. Hilary Swank for Million Dollar Baby ( Kangana / Bipasha (just maybe..))
17. Helena Bonham Carter for Fight Club/ Sweeney Todd (Koel Puri / Shilpa Shukla)
18. Julia Roberts for Erin Brockovich (Konkona / Kajol / Priety Zinta / Minisha Lambha)
19. Uma Thurman for Kill Bill (Urmila / Kangana)
20. Cate Blanchett for Elizabeth/ The Aviator/ Babel (sushmita Sen / Rituparna Sengupta)
21. Christina Ricci for Black Snake Moan (Tough! If either of the sen sisters could act, or maybe even Tanisha for
that matter.)
22. The action girls for Death Proof (haven’t seen yet)
I have been told my friends and heard by media about the fanatics of hollywood movies. when i cram the two strata of movies admittedly indian movies are one step ahead in terms of emotional movies. They have a lost feeling of sentimental movies and emotional actors. Not to mention, hollywood is on the verge of loosing its cavernous stratum of cinema.